r/politics • u/ben_watson_jr • May 19 '24

How Can This Country Possibly Be Electing Trump Again? Soft Paywall

https://newrepublic.com/article/181287/can-america-possibly-elect-trump-again
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265

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24 edited May 19 '24

I attribute this to two factors: first, people are really hurting from the cost of living crisis, and are perhaps desperate enough to believe that Donald Trump is the answer because they remember how food prices were cheaper pre-pandemic. (He’s not the answer, to be clear, but it’s easy to see why Johnny Lunchbox might see it that way.)

Second, there is a tremendous array of forces working in Donald’s favour: the entirety of conservative media, a fair portion of non-conservative media, an army of evangelicals, a large swath of social media (including the hellsite formerly known as Twitter), rich people who want to keep their tax breaks, Russian trolls and more than a few idiot lefties who look at politics as an all-or-nothing exercise - either they get everything they want or they kick over the gameboard.

However, there are also factors working against Donald: his criminal trial, his worsening finances (and that of the GOP) and his deteriorating mental state. In six months, it might be a completely different ballgame.

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u/crudedrawer May 19 '24

Second, there is a tremendous array of forces working in Donald’s favour:

This is the oft unspoken truth rihght here. The most powerful people in the world - from the supreme court to media CEOs to Putin and Musk and an entire universe of right wing podcasters and youtubers with huge reach - all want to make Biden lose. If he wins it will be the greatest victory of people over The Powers that Be and they'll STILL frame it as the elites keeping regular folks down.

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u/Outside_Function_726 May 19 '24

We have seen both of these 2 geezers run the show and it's a shit show......all politicians must go we need new leadership

19

u/Adoneus May 19 '24

But if you don’t participate you’re still stuck with one of the geezers. Doesn’t it just make sense to think logically and help the least bad one win?

4

u/Successful_Car4262 May 19 '24

These are not rational people you're talking to.

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u/POEness May 19 '24

Cool. Believe that all you want. If nothing matters and everything's horrible, use that as an excuse to vote Biden and downticket left.

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u/Outside_Function_726 May 19 '24

No you are still playing the game I refuse

11

u/heelstoo May 19 '24

If you’re not playing the game, the game still exists and you automatically lose. But, by not playing the game, you also hurt others on your team.

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u/ilfusionjeff May 19 '24

By simply “not playing the game” you’re voting for Trump. Thanks disaffected American for being so apathetic that we get a dictator.

3

u/Automatic_Rock_2685 May 19 '24

You're not doing anything novel. In reality, you're having the same effect as someone who is totally apathetic, so you might as well be too.

3

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

Except that we’ve seen one of those geezers act relatively competent. 

1

u/doom84b May 21 '24

Allowing Trump to win doesn’t mean all politicians leave, there’s no clean slate we get to build back from. The total opposite happens, the current conservative hegemony becomes permanently entrenched. If you want new leaders you have to get involved with local politics, unionize your work place, volunteer for progressive candidates, actually do the work to build that change. Instead it sounds like you are choosing to give the politicians you despise so much unlimited power

47

u/anti_hope_dealer May 19 '24

Just want to mention another little factor that should play its part in the election: Dobbs v Jackson

4

u/spoiler-its-all-gop May 19 '24

To me, that's IT. Every single race since Dobbs that has even tangentially involved abortion has been an ass kicking. Fucking Kansas, it won the ballot measure with 60%.

And who's fault is it that Dobbs happened?

I stfg that every opinion article about this written by men is useless. These writers don't get it.

5

u/heelstoo May 19 '24

I hope people haven’t forgotten this issue in November. It’s important, and people are so easily distracted (or stressed) by a variety of other issues.

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u/Kaiisim May 19 '24

Yup. Trump's biggest advantage is that if he wins he will destroy America as we know it. Lots and lots of forces have been attempting that for a loooooooooong time.

It used to be that Fox was bad, but the YouTube landscape is a thousand times worse.

6

u/Then_Cricket2312 May 19 '24

You also have to consider all the abortion stuff working against Trump. Hopefully that empowers a lot of women to come out and vote. I'm just scared the enthusiasm isn't the same as last time with young people since people might've forgotten how crazy the Trump presidency was.

3

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

You’d hope so, but democrats aren’t great at using the cards in their favor.

This should really be one of their key campaign points. 

3

u/glmory May 19 '24

Housing needs to be fixed and the Democrats are incredibly weak on that topic. Anyone looking at California and New York can see that housing for normal people practically doesn’t exist.

2

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

It is an issue, but one that will need work from lower levels 

2

u/YetiGuy May 19 '24

I give you one factor that can be further expanded into multiple but they have the same base. That one factor is Ethnocentrism. The tendency to view one’s own cultural group as superior and favor it exclusively.

This then gets down to two major factors: Race/Color and Religion. Abortion right was a huge issue for some religious conservatives. Similarly immigration is a huge issue for others.

Taxes and other personal gains are the remaining reason but that can exist on both sides.

2

u/Dank_Bonkripper78_ May 19 '24

This is over analyzing everything. Cost of living has skyrocketed and people want change. It’s really that simple. The average voter does not think that deeply about who they’re voting for

2

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24 edited May 19 '24

But from the perspective of Joe Lunchbox, how is voting for a heavily-indebted convicted criminal who’s wandering around on the debate stage with his pants around his ankles going to achieve this much-desired change?

1

u/Dank_Bonkripper78_ May 19 '24

They’re not thinking about the candidate. I’d venture to say the majority of Americans hate their choices in November. People vote with their wallets. Inflation skyrocketed under Biden (largely due to Trump economic policies) and they blame the president for that. They’ll tick the (R) box simply if it means the chance for something to change regardless of who’s bringing it.

2

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24 edited May 19 '24

Regardless of how desperate people are for change, I really think you’re overestimating the impact that criminal charges and Donald’s worsening mental state will guide how people vote.

MAGA cultists? Sure, they’ll vote for Donald no matter what. But think about the unaligned voter: if they see a senile old man who can’t speak intelligibly and is likely going to prison/some long-term care facility if he’s not elected to office, do you really think that unaligned voter will say, “Hmmm, clearly that disintegrating geezer is going to bring down my grocery bill?”

1

u/fredandlunchbox May 19 '24

The debates will probably mark a significant shift. I’m not sure which way, but we should see pretty clearly how the rest of this will go.   

My hunch is we’re all collectively going to go “Oh shit,” after we see both of them on stage.   

I say this as a steadfast Biden supporter.

2

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

The last debates didn’t change all that much. 

1

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24

Donald’s decline wasn’t as serious back in 2020. Also, if Trump agrees to Joe’s terms, he won’t be able to constantly shout over Biden.

1

u/Titanman401 May 19 '24

I was with you until you threw people sick of being shortchanged by the DNC’s choices under the bus (a.k.a. your “idiot lefties”). I’m not even thinking about voting for Trump.

2

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24 edited May 19 '24

You don’t have to vote for him; sitting out this election also serves Trump’s interests, as the MAGA cult is very motivated to elect their Orange Messiah.

As my replies show, there are many liberals who think by sitting out this election, they are achieving some moral victory.

I’m telling right now that victory is hollow, and the harm inflicted by Trump on migrants, abortion access, the environment and the people of Ukraine AND Palestine will be massive.

1

u/Tardislass May 19 '24

Can we also talk about how Israel and especially the far-right Zionist like Netanyahu and others want Trump to win? What pro-Palestinians don't know or remember is that Bibi LOVED Kushner and Trump and they were as close as Obama/Merkel.

Israel is licking its chops for Trump because they know Trump will allow everything to decimate Gaza. You'd never know from the MSM.

0

u/Shrimp_Lobster_Crab May 19 '24

His worsening finances? I have some bad news for you. May want to look up the ticker symbol DJT. It’s added billions to his wealth and has created a dangerous war chest for him.

1

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24 edited May 19 '24

Mmm, debatable. I had a look at the news: the stock is still quite volatile and everyone agrees it is over-valued. Since he can’t cash it out for a couple more months, there’s still time for that stock to bottom out.

0

u/Shrimp_Lobster_Crab May 19 '24

Not at all near the price where he won’t still be making billions. And he just got a price incentive bonus of more shares. He’s making bank on the nonsense that is DJT stock. I don’t like it, but it is reality. People can call him a fake billionaire but it’s certainly not true anymore.

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u/[deleted] May 19 '24

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u/chefkoch_ May 19 '24

That's plain stupid, everyone knows who Bibi wants elected.

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u/Coolegespam May 19 '24

Leftist like imdrinkingteaatwork don't give a shit about Palestine or anything else. They abuse words and terminology (just like a new speaking fascists). They believe the same lies and bullshit the right pedals to them.

Seriously, they're actively working to get Trump and his supporters into power. They are not allies to progress and would gladly sacrifice all the minority groups in the US so they can feel superior for a few moments. They're bad people, just like the GOP.

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u/imdrinkingteaatwork I voted May 19 '24

Then maybe Biden should do something about it.

4

u/chefkoch_ May 19 '24

And that is ...?

7

u/youwannasavetheworld May 19 '24

There will be a bigger genocide if america falls

-2

u/[deleted] May 19 '24

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u/windlep7 May 19 '24

No sadly this is the reality we live in. It’s not about good vs evil, it’s about evil vs less evil.

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u/imdrinkingteaatwork I voted May 19 '24

Not a reality worth living in.

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u/windlep7 May 19 '24

But you and billions of others do live in it, so you might as well try and make it less evil for everyone. Trump winning is good for no one.

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u/Necrowaif May 19 '24 edited May 19 '24

And how is electing Donald Trump going to rectify the situation, hmmm? Do you think he’s going to put his foot down and tell Israel, “Hey, stop hurting those poor Palestinians?”

And even if he was willing to take action to stop Israel, what about all the other people Donald Trump will harm?

It’s as I said: idiot lefties.

6

u/DoctorTheWho May 19 '24

Donald Trump literally said Israel should "finish Hamas" and people really think not voting for Biden will make a difference.

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u/deadcatbounce22 May 19 '24

When Trump pulls the aid and steps back from the conflict you’re going to get a chance to see what actual genocide looks like. And for a bonus you’ll get to see a much larger one in Ukraine.

0

u/imdrinkingteaatwork I voted May 19 '24

Then maybe the president we have should actually do something about it now…

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u/deadcatbounce22 May 19 '24

What can he legitimately do? Withholding aid is a feel good move and loses what little leverage he has. Israel has made it clear they will go it alone. Nothing short of military action will stop them.

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u/[deleted] May 19 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/deadcatbounce22 May 19 '24

Got it. You’ve got nothing specific.

Everyone watched the world stand by as 500,000 Syrians died at the hands of a madman. Israel knows the world has no stomach for another war in the ME.

3

u/iStayedAtaHolidayInn May 19 '24

Donald Trump has a goddamn Israeli settlement in the Golan Heights named after him

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u/imdrinkingteaatwork I voted May 19 '24

This isn’t about Donald Trump. This is about not being complicit in genocide.

5

u/windlep7 May 19 '24

Every decision that you make, including the decision not to act, will have negative consequences. It’s about doing the thing that will have less negative consequences. Not voting will only help Trump win. If Trump wins, he will never leave, he’ll make sure every future election is rigged in his and his family’s favour.

0

u/imdrinkingteaatwork I voted May 19 '24

Any decision that ends in genocide is not an acceptable decision.

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u/windlep7 May 19 '24

The decision to not participate will also end in genocide. You merely existing contributes to genocide (you generate pollution that is contributing to climate change, the death of ecosystems, etc).

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u/imdrinkingteaatwork I voted May 19 '24

Lol. I didn’t choose to live.

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u/emperor42 May 19 '24

Uh, glad you couldn't help but to take a shot at people who are against genocide as idiot lefties, like it's their job to pick your guy despite him not representing them

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u/DeterminedThrowaway May 19 '24

Their choice at this point is Trump who talks about "finishing the job", or Biden who is withholding aid in order to try to influence Israel to do better. If you care about the plight of the Palestinian people, allowing Trump to win truly would be an idiotic move as it's against your own goals. You don't get a make believe world where the left ran a different candidate. You get the world we have where it's between Trump and Biden.

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u/[deleted] May 19 '24

So your glamorous idea is to vote for the president that under his presidency inflation is thru the roof and cost of houses is the highest it’s ever been…and to keep voting for it?? Listen to yourself…living crisis. How much iq do you need to figure this one out. If you touch a hot stove once you learn to never touch it again….

3

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

Can you identify WHY inflation is through the roof and why can be done about it?

-3

u/[deleted] May 19 '24

Yes!! Stop spending money on useless bills and allowing illegal immigrants to cross the border and using tax payer money to fund their healthcare, their education, have you seen what’s happening in New York or Chicago? The residents absolutely hate it…Biden opened the flood gates and it won’t take another four years to stop it. We have stopped literal terrorists that have tried to come thru the southern border and Biden thinks it’s okay because it’ll get them votes.

To any future questions, yes I get it Trump is Not the best conservative presidential candidate but thats just the way things are right now. I’d rather have someone other than Biden with better vocational and speaking skills instead of slurring words and saying gibberish. To be fair both presidents have done this

3

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24

I think you’ve swallowed a lot of right-wing propaganda, pizza. There’s no great crisis happening in New York or Chicago, and Biden is projected to win the state of New York easily.

-1

u/[deleted] May 19 '24

lol sure sure. And you keep smoking that Biden crack

2

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

How will illegal immigration get Biden votes?

How does it affect inflation on a global scale?

What bills come to mind?

0

u/[deleted] May 19 '24

Do you want links to voter id laws by state and bills that show irresponsible government spending? You can get some research done yourself too as it is public information

How does America affect inflation on a global scale? Is this sarcasm or are you being genuine and don’t understand…to start where are the majority of the biggest companies in the world are located?

2

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

This doesn’t sound like proof of illegal immirgrants voting, rather, the fact that laws exist.

to start where are the majority of the biggest companies in the world are located?

Sorry, are you suggesting that the companies are raising prices because they’re paying for the health care of illegal immigrate?

1

u/[deleted] May 19 '24

You are special aren’t you

2

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 19 '24

You’re welcome to provide evidence of your claim. 

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u/[deleted] May 19 '24

You are also welcome to do your own research and come up with your own claims too. States that don’t have any regulation get abused like California. You don’t need an id to vote you just simply walk in

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u/Necrowaif May 19 '24 edited May 19 '24

Do you think inflation and the cost of living is somehow a uniquely American problem? As someone living outside of the U.S., I can tell you it is not. Biden had very little to do with that.

Trump has no solutions for these problems beyond tax breaks for the rich and trade wars, which already cost the American people an estimated $230 billion.

You’re telling me you won’t stick your hand on the hot stove, but are instead choosing to shove it into the furnace.

-2

u/[deleted] May 19 '24

Do I think it is an American problem? No, but if and usually how economics in the world works is if America has inflation so does the rest of the world. Biden has everything to do with it because he can lower or heighten inflation which he has done under his presidency. You ares paying you did something but blaming it on past events. It is his fault and if the next president increases it or lower it then it is their fault!

Do you have any idea as to a clue at how much Biden spent???

I don’t care where you live. I don’t care how much you earn or how smart you think you are. When the prices are going out of control and you can’t buy necessities like food or rent or buy a home and normal people can’t live then there has to be change. Biden is not that change otherwise it wouldn’t be like this

3

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24

Look, man, I’m not an economist, but I think you’re putting a little too much importance on the role of the President. He doesn’t control the world economy; there’s no lever in his office that he can pull and raise the menu prices at Taco Bell.

Also, you’re ignoring my point that Donald Trump does not have the solutions you are hoping for. He will only make things worse.

-2

u/[deleted] May 19 '24

Really? The president appoints others that do work in other sectors of the government which does in turn work down to what you pay.

You do understand the article what you just sent is for tariffs on cars right? The most bought cars in America are Toyotas where are they made? Not china or Mexico and please stop kidding yourself.

Biden literally undid laws that trump put in place to allow millions yes millions of illegals to illegally come into the country and are now going to vote democrat and use tax payer money on housing, food stamps, healthcare…it’s like a never ending chain of events.

2

u/Necrowaif May 19 '24

I think you skimmed this article, because you missed the part about Trump’s proposal for a 10 per cent across-the-board tariff on all imports and a 60 per cent tariff on imports from China. Coupled with that 100 per cent tariff on Mexican cars, the end result is a 0.7 per cent increase in inflation.

Also, as for migrants, the GOP only killed the bipartisan border bill at Trump’s bidding. Donald doesn’t want to better the country; he only wants power, and to avoid the consequences of his illegal actions.

1

u/Elegant_Plate6640 May 20 '24

There are actually several Tacoma manufacturers in the USA, that’s a well known fact about that brand.