r/politics • u/Murky-Site7468 • 4d ago

'Chill The F**k Out': John Fetterman Urges Democrats To Stick With Joe Biden | The Pennsylvania senator reminded panicked Democrats on Friday that he too had a bad debate once, yet he went on to win his Senate seat.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/joe-biden-debate-john-fetterman_n_667ea850e4b0415858d6a2f1
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u/essidus Minnesota 4d ago

The problem is that, right now, all of America believes that the Joe Biden we saw last night is an accurate reflection of how he is normally. If that's the case, we're in trouble.

Some people are saying that Biden has a cold or something. That might be (though it still doesn't reflect well on his cognitive function), but if that's true, Biden is going to prove it hard. He's going to need another extended public session showing how effective he really is. Otherwise, this debate is going to haunt him all the way up to the election.

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u/StainedBlue 4d ago

Ok, let's be real here. What we saw last night probably was an accurate reflection of how he is normally without a teleprompter. The real reason we're all voting for him – and let's face it – is because he's not Trump. That is itself a very good reason for democrats and left leaning voting, but it's not a good enough reason for undecided voters, else they wouldn't still be undecided. And with how close this election is, it is those undecided voters who will decide the election.

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u/USeaMoose 4d ago

I do wonder how much it is actually about undecided voters (ones who are actually unsure of if they should vote Trump or Biden), versus voter motivation (getting people to show up).

I have a hard time imagining that there really are millions out there that simply can't decide between Trump and Biden. Trump has worked hard to alienate anyone who is not a hardcore supporter of his. And the two are polar opposite on almost everything. If you think that the US is falling apart, and sending too much money to other countries while letting too many people into our country, then you vote Trump. If you are supportive of NATO and the US's involvement in global issues, as well as issues like reproductive rights, and various social issues, you vote Biden.

What topics do you have to care about where you are really undecided between the two? It's not like the past where each side would try to win over the other side's voters by avoiding taking too firm a stance on most things, especially controversial topics. Where each side had just a couple key topics that differentiated them, but otherwise they both ended up saying more or less the same thing.

My assumption is that it is mostly about motivation. If people of the left or the right start thinking that their party's choice for President is not so great, they much just not show up to vote. Maybe because they can't bring themselves to do it, or maybe because they assume it's a lost cause.

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u/OptionXIII 4d ago

The voter who is so principled that they are absolutely sure they are going to vote, but can't choose between these two candidates only exists on cable TV.

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u/Jake_373 3d ago

I'm going to vote but I'm not sure who I'm going to vote for yet. It exists but its definitely far from the majority of people.

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u/StainedBlue 4d ago

Voter turnout definitely matters, but it kinda buffers itself in competitive races, which this one, by some absurd tragedy, very much is.

It's like this. Party A's numbers suggest increased voter turnout for them. Party B's voters take notice of this, freaks out, and in turn, increase their own turnout. The end result is that there isn't too much difference. The only time this isn't the case is when a specific demographic has voter turnout that takes everyone by surprise. But due to how much this election has been spotlighted, I think such surprises would be harder to miss ahead of time

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u/gmishaolem 4d ago

I have a hard time imagining that there really are millions out there that simply can't decide between Trump and Biden.

They're not deciding between Trump and Biden: They're deciding between Biden and not voting. And no amount of "It's your civic duty!" or "This is the hand we've been dealt, so suck it up and do it anyway!" will change that.

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u/dBlock845 4d ago

I'm sure there are a good percentage of low information/undecided voters out there that aren't captured by these polling firms but I think that voter motivation is more important than capturing undecided voters. I feel as if most undecided voters usually don't vote and most likely won't vote in this election. In a vacuum (opponent isn't Trump), would you vote for someone that didn't look healthy and is trying to be president until he is 85? That is nearly five more years of aging and unless DARPA invents the Fountain of Youth imagine how he would look during the 2026 Midterms for example. We'll see what happens, if he isn't going to drop out he needs to have weekly press conferences to show the public that he can still hang.

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u/Ill_Page_7451 3d ago

think that the US is falling apart, and sending too much money to other countries while letting too many people into our country, then you vote Trump

I think this and am still begrudgingly voting blue because what Trump will do is still way worse, but fuck Biden and his refusal to step down