'Chill The F**k Out': John Fetterman Urges Democrats To Stick With Joe Biden | The Pennsylvania senator reminded panicked Democrats on Friday that he too had a bad debate once, yet he went on to win his Senate seat.

[u/Murky-Site7468]

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/joe-biden-debate-john-fetterman_n_667ea850e4b0415858d6a2f1

[u/noiserr]

"Delivered some coherent responses" that comment alone should trigger a protest against what the party is doing to this elderly man.

Trump delivered no coherent and factual responses as far as I could tell. So that was my point. He never stayed on point and while he did look and sound about 30 years younger, his debate performance was absolutely terrible as well.

Listen I do hope dems pick someone younger. But I do actually believe Biden could still win.

The reason I say this is because Biden didn't win on enthusiasm of his voters the first time. He won because he's a decent man and America hates Trump. The debate didn't change this. And if anything this may motivate more blue voters to come out and vote.

[u/Agent_Scoon → u/noiserr]

If you're telling me that trump made 0 factual statement in the entire debate then this conversation cannot continue. That is such extreme bias it's not even worth discussing.

I am personally not voting for trump but why would I ever say he said 0 factual things in the whole debate. Thats a really bad take.

How is Biden a good man? He's been a historical pro war politician who has dead Palestinian children's blood on his hands. Hes a guy that opposed lgbtq rights for just about 70+ years of his life. He is hardly a democrat. The party is failing because they keep nominating people like him instead of Bernie that has a historical political career of consistently for human rights. Bernie is a good man. Joe Biden is a purely a politician.

[u/noiserr → u/Agent_Scoon]

If you're telling me that trump made 0 factual statement in the entire debate then this conversation cannot continue. That is such extreme bias it's not even worth discussing.

Feel free to point some out, but every response I heard from Trump was either deflection, self aggrandizement or blatant lies: "I did not sleep with a prostitute!"

I mean that one line should be enough to sink any would be president's campaign in an instant. Considering he just got convicted for bribing the said prostitute in a hush money trial for it. But because it's Trump it's normalized for some reason.

And he again refused to say that he would concede the election if he lost it. Like this should disqualify him from running from office, given what happened on Jan6 and the plot to overturn the government with fake electors.

Sometimes I think I'm living in a twilight zone, how is Trump eligible for office?

He accused Biden for being a Chinese Manchurian candidate, while in the same breath admitting he talked to Putin about letting him take Ukraine.

Yes Biden lost the debate because he looked out of it. But he's still a miles better candidate than Trump, who's a lying grifter, convicted criminal, would be dictator who doesn't believe in peaceful transition of power.

How is Biden a good man? He's been a historical pro war politician who has dead Palestinian children's blood on his hands. Hes a guy that opposed lgbtq rights for just about 70+ years of his life. He is hardly a democrat. The party is failing because they keep nominating people like him instead of Bernie that has a historical political career of consistently for human rights. Bernie is a good man. Joe Biden is a purely a politician.

Please. Israel is an "ally". A president does not have the power to change 70 years of foreign policy in an instant. Particularly considering the powerful lobby he's up against. There are definitely signs of him putting pressure on Netanyahu, something you would not get with Trump. He is also pushing for a 2 state solution, which many believe is the only thin thread towards peace. Anyone who thinks any other president would act any differently is just being naive.

Hes a guy that opposed lgbtq rights for just about 70+ years of his life.

Biden is old. America has changed drastically when it comes to LGBTQ rights in the past 20 years. Besides he's done a lot of pro LGBTQ things now. Again. This is in start contrast to any republican. Check out his pro LGBTQ timeline and you will seen he's done a lot of good things here: https://www.hrc.org/resources/president-bidens-pro-lgbtq-timeline

Frankly I can't think of any other president who's done more for the LGBTQ community.

[u/Agent_Scoon → u/noiserr]

To make this simple. I scrolled to a random part of the debate and trump talked about how the United States conducted an operation which resulted in the death of Al-baghdadi. This statement is factual. You said trump made 0 factual statements. How do you dispute this as false?

Trumps statement was "I did not have sex with a porn star" and to be pedantic on language that statement is true. The person he had sex with at that time was not a porn star. This is why language is extremely important.

Example: if I worked at McDonald's 20 years ago and work at Burger King now then slept with someone. If they said "I slept with a McDonald's worker" that is a false statement. Trump is very very deceptive in his speech but he makes himself right even in a sneaky immoral way.

Again, he's sneaky and language and speech is important. He said he would accept the results IF it was a fair election. Why does he do this tactic? Because fair is quite subjective .. if one vote is accidentally miscounted does that constitute a fair election? Human errors occur. If that's his definition of fair he may never concede.

Trump is eligible for office given our laws. Whether you and I agree with this or not.

My logic on Biden not supporting lgbtq for majority of his life is not necessarily to say he hasn't done anything but to show how good of a person Bernie is. Bernie has fought for rights for LBGTQ since the 1970s if I am not mistaken. So while Bernie was fighting for these rights for decades and Biden was never on board.. finally 50 years later Biden hops on board ? I know people can change but my opinion thinks this is for votes.

[u/noiserr → u/Agent_Scoon]

Are you the Bernie bro who voted for Trump in 2016?

[u/Agent_Scoon → u/noiserr]

You really can't dispute how trump saying the United States had an operation resulting in the death of Al-Baghdadi? This is a very important part of the conversation. You said he said 0 factual statements so you mustn't beleive that Al-baghdadi is actually dead?

No, I personally would never vote for trump. I believe I voted Green Party that year.

I am enjoying this conversation and am learning a lot from you but it's hard when I answer each of your questions but you don't do the same for me. It's by no means mandatory but makes it a little easier.

[u/noiserr → u/Agent_Scoon]

I personally can't be bothered to find that particular answer. But he may have said a few factual things in the storm of lies, whining, ok? Someone who lies 90% of the time is not exactly better than someone who lies 100% of the times. He's still a liar of epic proportions.

I believe I voted Green Party that year.

That's basically a Trump vote. Jill Stein is a Russian useful idiot who played the spoiler role like RFK jr. is right now.

[u/Agent_Scoon → u/noiserr]

It's funny you say that my democrat friends tell me my green vote was basically a vote for trump and my republican friends tell me my green vote was a vote for biden. Which is it?? Sounds like I voted for two people with one vote XD

[u/noiserr → u/Agent_Scoon]

Trump won, so it's effectively the vote for Trump. Considering Hillary lost by a small margin, your vote could have prevented the absolute shitstorm we've all been living since 2016.

[u/Agent_Scoon → u/noiserr]

If Hillary wanted my vote she should have won my vote. I don't base my vote on their opponent. I have voted for every "main" party in my voting history and have even done a write in. I vote for who I believe will do the best job.

[u/noiserr → u/Agent_Scoon]

If Hillary wanted my vote she should have won it.

You still don't get it though? It's not about Hilary. It's about the loss of democracy and the irreparable damage Trump has done to this country. Starting from packing the supreme court with corrupt conservative judges.

[u/Agent_Scoon → u/noiserr]

If it's not about Hillary then bring up the points you want to discuss. Only up till now you talked about the loss of democracy.

[u/noiserr → u/Agent_Scoon]

Sorry. I thought it's common knowledge that Trump's presidency weakened our country. Even America's credit rating was downgraded due to Jan 6.

The real progressive change was set back by decades. Thanks to the Supreme Court appointments Trump has made. I don't know your stance on Roe v Wade, but that too will be extremely difficult to undo.

This country has a real problem with corporate influence in politics, and the only way to overturn decisions like Citizens United (which allows dark money to fund politicians) is through the Supreme Court as well. Which is now firmly in hands of conservatives for the next 30 years, thanks to protest votes against Hillary.