r/politics • u/croato87 • 6d ago

America Lost the First Biden-Trump Debate Soft Paywall

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/america-lost-first-biden-trump-debate-1235048539/
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u/Wonderful_Way_7389 6d ago edited 6d ago

But who? Honestly who. I would LOVE if we had someone nationally loved who was a contender but I for one can't think of anyone good enough. That i think is the biggest mistake America makes btw. We don't groom enough people to be contenders. In the fast media world we live in, they don't just come out of the woodworks. It's a risk to put up a nobody too right?

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u/golden_eel_words 6d ago

Obviously Newsom is being mentioned a lot here. Newsom is whip smart and has the right policies for a strong and unified democratic party. He would have absolutely mopped the floor with Trump last night (anybody could have; that debate was a layup).

Newsom probably won't, though, because it's a hard win and it would sour his chances of success in a 2028 run if he lost.

Buttigieg works for me. The whole "but moderates won't vote for a gay person" thing might be true, but at this point we're not even trying to court any so-called "moderates": we're needing to retain existing Biden voters and make the youth enthusiastic to vote. He'd be able to do that. He's also exceptionally intelligent and well spoken and has all the leadership qualities that a president requires.

Whitmer is fine. So are a handful of others. There's options.

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u/Wonderful_Way_7389 6d ago

If we were in 2023 I would agree with you regarding all of the above by the way. But 5 months out. You think all the uncommitted and people in swing states are as clued in as you? I don't know man. I think it's a risk. Losing would be...disastrous

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u/golden_eel_words 6d ago

Maybe this election was lost the minute Biden announced running for a 2nd term. Maybe you're right and backtracking now is untenable, 5 months out. I just can't stop thinking about how I'd personally feel about a different candidate, even this late in the game, which is renewed enthusiasm, and I just know I'm not alone in that. So yeah, it's all "maybes".

Losing would be disastrous. And here's the thing: once this conversation is over about whether he can/should/would move on, I'll shut my mouth and get back in line and vote for him. I can't imagine what this country will look like in 4 years if Trump wins, and I'll do whatever I can to lessen that as a possibility. But while we're having this conversation, in the moment, I feel like it's fair to discuss how we actually feel and I'm annoyed with pundits who tell me how I should feel.

Cheers to a dem win in 2024, in the end. Let's make that happen, whatever it takes.

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u/Wonderful_Way_7389 6d ago

Ah fair. If it's a rant only - I came to this conclusion about voting for the party and not the person etc after A LOT of wrestling with the above. I literally cannot BELIEVE it's come to voting for someone i believe genuinely has had a wonderful career but now should be in his home surrounded by loved ones and family and that awful orange man. I cannot BELIEVE that the person in charge of such incredibly important things - the most important job in the world can't speak coherently. That we let this happen when we had four years THIS time around to make a change. That the GOP and its policies are so odious in 2024, that democracy is at stake in a country that literally gave birth to the concept. I'm angry about so many things. But like you, I'm rolling up my sleeves and doing what needs to be done. With a firm belief though, that we get it right next time

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u/golden_eel_words 6d ago

I know it's lame to post "+1" style comments on Reddit because that's what the upvote button is for, but "+10000000000" to this anyway. You and I are in 100% agreement on all of this.

Onward! I'll try to refrain from doom posting on this anymore; it's time to move past this and do whatever it takes to just win this darned thing.

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u/Wonderful_Way_7389 6d ago

Hah. It's always nice to meet a nice minded person on this app! Let's go!

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u/Wonderful_Way_7389 2d ago

Can I just say that you may have been right? This is not going away. This is a disaster. We need to win. If more and more people are saying they would vote if the candidate ISNT Biden then maybe that's what needs to happen

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u/golden_eel_words 2d ago

I worry that every passing day makes it exponentially less likely to happen, as far as finding a new candidate. I think we're going to be "pot committed" to Biden for this cycle.

I still don't like it and am trying REALLY HARD to find optimism (especially with how dire the recent SCOTUS rulings are). I'm seeing polls that a lot of Gen Z are moving away from Biden, and that's not great.

I hope we can find some solid messaging in the coming months that helps sway them back into the fold. I think the "he's not Trump" message is useful, but not enough. Maybe revisit Biden's SOTU and lean into his policies/platform? He was supposed to do that at the debate, but I hope that's where the DNC/Biden campaign start to draw more from. Child care credits, paying teachers well, enshrining Roe, addressing greedflation, working on first time home buyer credits and adjusting ratges... the good stuff. Now he'll need to also add in some plan for fixing SCOTUS, too, though.

I think it's dire, but maybe not completely lost. I have to believe that, anyway.

Edit: I can't stop thinking about worst case, though, which is Trump winning. There might even be a silver lining there for 2028. 4 years of whatever chaos and hell that he brings could really reset the democratic party and maybe even force their hand to seriously consider progressive candidates. That's a long way out with a lot of damage (some irreparable) along the way, but if I have to look for a silver lining on a Biden loss here, that's all I've got.

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u/Wonderful_Way_7389 1d ago

Yeah I'm with you on the silver lining. I find myself daydreaming about "teaching the DMC a lesson" for fielding us a candidate they had to know wasn't up to the job because they know we'll have to fall in line. Trump winning, NOT doing as much damage as i know he will (cos it's my daydream) because he just isn't able to figure out how to do pretty much anything and the right mythical figures hold him back. 4 years fly by, we are able to recover quickly with an AMAZING young, eloquent, kind, more progressive and less "centerist" candidate who comes in quickly, resets the damage and we are off to the races in a new, beautiful and just America. We never get an unfit candidate again because lessons learn and America is saved! What a wow.

Please ignore the above fantasy. Because it's exactly that. But a girl is allowed to dream. Thank you