r/politics • u/rollingstone Rolling Stone • May 15 '24

Biden Challenges Trump to Two Debates. Trump Immediately Accepts Soft Paywall

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/biden-challenges-trump-debates-1235021164/
18.7k Upvotes

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397

u/KarateKid1984 May 15 '24

The top post on the conservative sub is “the Biden campaign officially turns down debate commission”.

Man, they’ll reframe anything to make it look better for them.

141

u/[deleted] May 15 '24 edited May 15 '24

I mean the RNC left the commission, didn't they? Even then, the media is pretty biased towards Trump because they want a spectacle instead of a debate.

52

u/linknewtab Europe May 15 '24

Just look at Nate Silver's reaction: https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1790738966980804928

The last time they allowed Trump to debate with Covid and almost kill Biden and now Biden not working with them is somehow sacrilege.

42

u/mr_potatoface May 15 '24

Anyone who watched more than 5 minutes of the 2016 or 2020 debates and compares it to prior election debates should understand the validity to Biden's letter. It went from a boring, dry, mostly factual albeit biased exchange of information to something you'd expect out of a reality series. Jerry Springer had better control over his guests than the moderators did of Trump.

16

u/Evadrepus Illinois May 15 '24

He fails to point out that the RNC already backed out of the debate commission in April.

You expect Biden to debate a chair, like a delirious actor?

1

u/ScaredLionBird May 16 '24

delirious actor?

Yes, actually. They do expect that.

10

u/gavran5 May 15 '24

He's getting bodied in the comments, and rightly so.

11

u/HarrumphingDuck Washington May 15 '24 edited May 15 '24

My initial reaction was the same as Silver's, but after reading the letter, I completely reversed my stance. Those are all very good points.

19

u/Killfile May 15 '24

If anything, Biden should be dragging the Committee. It's been a shit-show for years.

  1. You allowed a candidate to attempt to assassinate another candidate with an improvised biological weapon.
  2. You completely failed to enforce the rules of the debate in terms of talk-clocks
  3. You have refused to adjust the debate schedule to account for changes in how Americans vote.

6

u/linknewtab Europe May 15 '24

Also people act like this is some old, sacred institution. The committee was formed in the late 80s.

4

u/ICBanMI May 15 '24

Should go back to the The League of Women Voters. Literally did not tolerate a lot of crap.

1

u/pkosuda May 16 '24 edited May 16 '24

I can’t believe he is still relevant. Sold off 538 to ABC which basically scrapped the whole thing (or at least the parts that made it unique) as of last year, and even then his “model” was shaky at best. Every time it was wrong he would repeat “you don’t understand statistics, it being wrong just means one of the less likely outcomes I said could still happen, happened”. Like great but if that’s your argument, then anybody’s model is as good as yours so long as they don’t have a 0% chance for any given result to happen.

A shame because I followed his stuff very closely in 2020. But he overestimated Democrats’ chances just as he did in 2016. At this point his and other pollsters’ stuff just ends up allowing people to be complacent by not going out to vote. Only sure answer is after Election Day, not any days before that.

0

u/Chaotic-Catastrophe May 15 '24

Biased*

Bias is what you have. Biased is what you are.

-2

u/Ironborn137 May 15 '24

Yeah, we got that.

4

u/AndrysThorngage May 15 '24

Sometimes I read through there out of curiosity. It's a completely different world.

3

u/KarateKid1984 May 15 '24

It’s really wild. I’m actually banned from commenting. Anyone who doesn’t share their view is. They’re building an echo chamber of one viewpoint.

1

u/AveragelyTallPolock May 15 '24

Well... yeah, it's a fuster cluck of conservatives, what did you expect?

To be fair, it is a complete polar opposite of what you and I typically think of.

A conservative posts their views here and it's downvoted into oblivion and they're called fascist scum, possibly even removed depending on what it is.

Over there, if you or I post, we're downvoted into oblivion and called liberal devils or something, probably removed too.

The difference I'd like to think between the two is your exact point, it's an echo chamber of one viewpoint, anything not hard right is usually removed. Whereas normally here, if (as long as it's not full blown harassment), it's not removed and just downvoted to hell.

It really is just looking into a reflecting pool. They're complete opposite in almost every way... but it's also the exact same. Like a negative photo.

0

u/AstroTurfedShitHole May 16 '24

The projection from this comment is fucking crazy.

1

u/FruitBroot May 15 '24

And they don't even talk about the bribing with the oil companies OR the willingness to tear down wind power on the coasts. Isn't that 100% a conservative issue? They put their heads in the sand so far and only want to hear bad news from the other side so make them feel good that they're on the side they picked.

This is what's so frustrating with them. It's not all of them but a loud majority of them. Don't you think we should find a common ground to work together? Both candidates we have to choose from are bad candidates. Just one is horrible.

1

u/bnovc May 16 '24

Seems like it could be a way to avoid debating RFK?

1

u/Icy-Understanding400 4d ago

You think you guys aren't as bad, look at the confidence you guys had in a senile man before the debate

-29

u/littletinydickballs May 15 '24

they reframed it, just as Rolling Stone omitted that the offer comes outside the debate commission with unique demands and stipulations from Biden. we all have our political bias

39

u/slymm May 15 '24

Biden's camp offered to negotiate with Trump's camp. Biden's camp also said crowds are bad because of x and y. I don't think that qualifies as demands

-49

u/littletinydickballs May 15 '24

demanded changes to traditional debate commission sanctioned format. :)

29

u/slymm May 15 '24

No. Refused to participate in debate commission sanctioned format. Offered an opportunity for an alternative.

Biden didn't demand anything from anyone. He doesn't have the power to demand anything from the commission, nor demand anything from Trump.

-19

u/tet19 May 15 '24

He just won’t do it unless trump agrees to the conditions….i guess that’s one way to phrase a demand as not a demand

9

u/bunkSauce May 15 '24

Demand ~ an insistent and peremptory request, made as if by right.

Preremptory ~ putting an end to or precluding a right of action, debate, or delay. specifically : not providing an opportunity to show cause why one should not comply. a peremptory mandamus.

2

u/TentativeIdler May 15 '24

I can't take something from a store without giving them money, are they demanding my money? They made the offer, it's up to me if it's worth accepting.

9

u/qwaai May 15 '24

The commission that Republicans abandoned first?

This is such a strange way to frame what's happened.

23

u/bunkSauce May 15 '24

Changes that were never needed (like mic cut off) until candidates began to talk over the other.

Is that the type of debate you find constructive?

-21

u/littletinydickballs May 15 '24

idk, that’s completely irrelevant to the point

14

u/fishsticklovematters May 15 '24

How so? There was never a need for turning off mics (or telling participants to not wander and stand behind their opponent when they were talking) before Trump made the debates a spectacle instead of an actual...you know...debate.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2017/08/23/hillary-clinton-trump-debate-skin-crawled-book-sot-nr.cnn

25

u/bunkSauce May 15 '24

You are an ineffective troll, and I have let reddit know of your false self-harm report you just made.

9

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

Good on you! They take that very seriously actually.

-12

u/littletinydickballs May 15 '24

that wasn’t me but okay, deflect, duck, disengage! is this the type of discussion you find constructive?

20

u/jaboooo May 15 '24

Go for it man. Keep ducking and dodging I guess. This is kinda sad.

6

u/tresslesswhey May 15 '24

Didn’t the republican party ditch the debate commission altogether?

1

u/omniron May 15 '24

The commission has regularly negotiated details and formatting in the past

11

u/TeriusRose May 15 '24

I don't know if this specifically applies to Trump's campaign but the Republican party withdrew from the presidential debate commission two years ago.

And Trump has been railing against the debate commission/threatening to not participate with them for years, claiming it's biased against him.

Given that context, I'm not sure how offering something both the RNC (explicitly) and Trump himself (not explicitly) have laid out as their preference (presidential debates outside of the commission) reflects poorly on Biden's campaign.

17

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

Okay, why don’t you lay out those demands for us? We can think for ourselves and decide whether or not they seem reasonable.

-9

u/littletinydickballs May 15 '24

they’re in the article!

16

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

I am aware, so how are they bad? Or are you admitting that they’re not bad at all? 😂

-3

u/SerendipityAlike May 15 '24

Are you lost? Nobody you’re replying to said or even implied that they were “bad”.

1

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

Hey, as long as we agree that the new rules are actually a good thing then I have no qualms 😂

-6

u/littletinydickballs May 15 '24

who said they’re “bad?” emojis often indicate a weak argument!

14

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

Lmao okay cool, so we agree that Joe is in the right on this one. Good talk! Weak trolling though lmao.

2

u/littletinydickballs May 15 '24

Not sure that’s how logic works, but thanks for taking the time to share your opinions with me!

13

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

Lmao so did you have a point? 😂

-5

u/The_CancerousAss Texas May 15 '24

I actually like democracy so ousting third parties regardless of their polling numbers seems a bit fascist to me

4

u/bejammin075 May 15 '24

I'd like to have more 3rd party options, but there are none out there doing the work to build up from smaller regional elections. It's like expecting to be in the baseball World Series without ever establishing A, AA, and AAA divisions.

3

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

For real, most of these accounts saying they will vote third party can’t usually even remember any names of third party candidates lmao

3

u/Gr8lakesCoaster May 15 '24

I agree they should let 3rd parties in but how is it fascist?

1

u/Tellyourdadisay_hi May 15 '24

Lmao people not taking your candidate seriously because he is an idiot is literally the definition of democracy.

4

u/tresslesswhey May 15 '24

Can you cite data showing that emojis indicate a weak argument?

0

u/[deleted] May 16 '24

[deleted]

2

u/Darkblitz9 May 16 '24

What does that have to do with the fact that the conservative title is bunk? They're making it seem like he's trying not to debate, which is a lie. He just doesn't want to debate after people have already been able to cast their votes, which is entirely fair. That's why he's holding two of his own, prior to that time.

This information is in the article, and is available to everyone here and there. Only one of the subs' post titles is twisting what's presented therin to fit an agenda.