r/nottheonion • u/DerangedUnicorn27 • 4d ago

Convicted child rapist qualifies for Olympics

https://www.newsweek.com/steven-van-de-velde-dutch-beach-volleyball-olympics-1918442
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u/DerangedUnicorn27 4d ago

Yep, true story. It’s appalling and disgusting. And a depressing number of people support him.

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u/osku1204 4d ago

Their whole argument is "Well he paid his debt To society, shouldnt he get a change?" calling getting a one year sentence In a dutch prison paying your debt To society is mind numbing.

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u/DelirousDoc 4d ago

TBF. The Dutch don't view prison as "paying the debt to society" but as the purpose of rehabilitating criminals and to only hold criminals where it is absolutely necessary for safety of the community. I could get behind this thinking.

That being said, 1 year is not enough time to ensure this man is not a danger to the community in my opinion.

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u/x3tan 3d ago

Doesn't help that even following "rehabilitation", he's not because he doesn't seem to have any remorse about it. He apparently groomed her from 10years old.

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u/Fus_Roh_Nah_Son 3d ago

yanno maybe the sentence should be longer than the actual crime

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u/TherealOmthetortoise 4d ago

I’d have to agree. Rehabilitating is a great concept and has a lot to recommend it… but not for this type of crime.

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u/Draconic64 3d ago

So do you believe in rehabilitative justice? Everyone online I see supporting it online alaways put an exception to it, like "I think we should have rehabiltative prisons, but not for pedophiles" but what makes that crime in particular not elogible for rehabilitation

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u/AMaleficentFox 3d ago edited 3d ago

You'll quickly find that people "believe in rehabilitative justice" until they come across an offender that actually did something really bad and thus severe enough to actually need rehabilitation. Sex crimes, assault, murder, you name it. "There's no coming back from that," they say from the country with the highest recidivism rates on Earth, with the highest incarceration rates on Earth by an enormous margin. We call ourselves the best country on Earth and literally everyone else has figured this out better than we have. The general populous is much safer AND much fewer of them are in jail. We live in a country more dangerous than Yemen, barely beating out Zimbabwe in lower homicides per capita.

The communist in me says that this is a symptom of liberalism, but even liberal Europe has figured this out orders of magnitude better than the US. It's an American pathology.

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u/galactictock 1d ago

You had me until that last paragraph

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u/taco_roco 23h ago

literally everyone else has figured this out better than we have.

I get that 'literal' literally doesn't mean literal anymore but c'mon.

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u/hikerchick29 12h ago

Liberal Europe has it figured out?

Liberal Europe just let a convicted pedophile out of jail and into the fucking OLYMPICS after a goddamn year, and you think they’ve got their shit figured out?

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u/Never_Gonna_Let 3d ago

You can't rehabilitate or recondition a paraphila. Sexual wiring is very ingrained, it isn't a choice, it is a compulsion. Conversion camps for homosexuality never worked and they tried all manner of things, including some very messed up stuff. Nothing "works."

Pedophiles will always represent a threat to children. Chemical castration and restricting sex hormones to reduce libidos may reduce impulses, but pedophiles still rape children even under those conditions, even if they have to use tool to do so, and try to form romantic and dependent relationships. Even when a pedophile doesn't act on their impulses with nearby children, their existence increases the demand for pornographic material that creates more victims. Even fictional/animated content conditions and reinforces the compulsion until they act on it.

Until we can re-wire the human brain, people with things like pedophilia, anthropophagolagnia, erotophonophilia/dacnolagnomania and the shouldn't be "rehabilitated." They should be removed from integrated society so they do not represent a threat to other people.

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u/JAC165 3d ago

i don’t think the rehabilitation in those cases is analogous to conversion like that, or at least it shouldn’t be, rather it should be about the offender understanding the paraphilia and the consequences of acting on it, kind of in the same way that many people have a burning desire to have money, but understand stealing is absolutely off limits. yes, you can’t recondition a paraphilia, but you can rehabilitate the offender to not reoffend. there will of course be cases with no path to safe release of the offender, and then yes they should be kept away from society, just the same as we’d keep a murderer who cannot be rehabilitated away from people they could harm

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u/Never_Gonna_Let 2d ago

but you can rehabilitate the offender to not reoffend

Citation needed.

There is no effective rehabilitation technique for pedophilia that statistically reduces the likelihood of recidivism. No parole program, treatment plan, medication, therapy, etc. There isn't even a method of predicting when pedophiles are more likely to reoffend.

We cannot ethically research reoffense rates outside of criminal convictions, which in sex crimes aren't exactly the painting the whole picture. As that would involve polling pedophiles and getting them to answer questions like, "When did you last hurt a child?" honestly, which they are not going to do for obvious reasons. However, when looking at the assorted methods that have been tried to recondition other paraphilas, we know that reducing compulsive sexual behavior is not going to happen.

The only thing that reduces recidivism in child sex crimes is public awareness of the offender, such that they are not allowed opportunities to collect more victims. When there is no awareness? They can really rack them up, see the Catholic Church as an example.

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u/thetwoandonly 3d ago

Life isn't black or white. Things can have caveats.

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u/balsag43 3d ago

and are those caveats based on facts and studies?

what tests has america done that those europeans havent heard of?

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u/thechaddening 3d ago edited 3d ago

Because you can't rehabilitate them of their pedophilia any more than gay conversion therapy works. They're pedophiles. They will always be pedophiles and nothing will ever change that. I mean, theoretically there could be a brain surgery or something to change that but then people would scream that it violates their human rights so it wouldn't happen anyways.

Edit: dude who replied below utilized weaponized blocking to get the last word, so I'll put this here.

Pedophiles have a much higher recidivism rate than other types of sex of offenders, the highest, in fact. And that's without taking into account that child sex abuse is vanishingly unlikely to even get reported to police and end in a conviction. Studies estimate between 1 and 5% chance. And roughly 10-20% of pedophiles end up with another conviction, when there's only a 1-5% chance per child to get caught. The writing is on the walls there, do basic math and you can see how many lives are being destroyed. these people reoffend at a horrifically high rate and I don't believe that they should be let out to destroy lives because maybe they're in the minority that doesn't reoffend.

I care far more for a child's right to not be raped than I do for a pedophiles right to be in the general public around children. Once you've abused a child you're done and I have no empathy to give you.

I also find anyone downvoting this sentiment to be sus as fuck.

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u/galactictock 1d ago

Tons of people in this thread claiming to have tons of evidence and yet providing none. Drop a link already

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u/thechaddening 23h ago

It takes one 30 second Google search to find all the evidence you need

Specifically these numbers came from the department of justice overview on sexual violence cases.

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u/rgtn0w 3d ago

Bro I can't believe it, I've seen it mentioned and almost a little meme'd on the liberal side of reddit that, you'll see people in thread that reach /r/all be like "YEAH PRISON IS FOR REFORMATION WHY DO WE PERMANENTLY PUNISH PEOPLE" when it's some felony charges for some smaller crimes.

Literally anything heavier than that and I don't think any of these people could actually tell you what would be good "rehab" or even time, or anything and just be like "lock them up forever"

Ok i actually found the one I saw a long time ago

Like you cannot have it both ways people, the person above here calls it "one years is not enough" ok then how long is good enough then? Can we even define a real number for this?

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u/Draconic64 3d ago

My theory is that those are not the same people, or just people who repeat what they heard without thought. For me, there's no time needed, because no two human beings are the same, so why would two centences be the same?

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u/Stnq 3d ago

Unless he's physically or chemically castrated, he's still a pedophile. You can't pray the pedophilia away anymore you can pray the gay away.

Sure, let him out after 1 year if you make sure he's literally unable to act on his urges. Chemically or surgically.

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u/Draconic64 3d ago

What if he psychologically blocks his urges? Gay people exist too but they don't rape any men, just like pedophiles may be attracted to kids but they aren't wired to rape them. Anyway, do you have proofs to back up your claims?

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u/Ok-Package-7578 3d ago

Yeah, that poor girl doesn't get justice for this

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u/riko_rikochet 3d ago

She gets to serve a life sentence with no parole.

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u/MikesRockafellersubs 4d ago

It works for crimes that non-criminals could understand doing themselves, not for most violent crimes.

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u/labbetuzz 3d ago

I mean in this case, how can you even claim that he's been rehabilitated whatsoever?

There's no way you're done dealing with that shit in one year, the fact that he's never shown an ounce of remorse just shows how the system has failed both him and more importantly, the victim.

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u/Central_Incisor 3d ago

this type of crime..

I think this is the problem most people have. They fail to recognize different crimes have different actions that are best for society as a whole. Even drug abuse covers an overly broad umbrella of reasons and solutions.

That said I don't know what is the best route for society to take with this person.

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u/dystropy 3d ago edited 3d ago

Might be surprising for people to know this but rape/sexual assault is the major crime category that has the best rehabilitation rate among all crime categories. If the goal is not punishment but rehab, then statistically rape/sexual assault have the best outcomes by recidivism rates, source from US Bureau of Justice Statistics
https://www.prisonpolicy.org/graphs/sex_offense_recidivism_2019.html

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u/happinesscreep 3d ago

As cathartic as revenge and punishment are, they are not productive and do not make society better.

That said, pedos and murderers should not be allowed back into society like that. They are a danger to everyone around them.

Of course, USA is all "crime and punishment," yet the actual time served for a lot of pedos here is LOW as well. Because no one actually cares about the kids' safety in the end I guess.

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u/LanaDelHeeey 3d ago

Not to defend him or anything, but what is objectively the right amount of time to ensure he isn’t a danger? Like will 5 years vs 1 year really make a difference? And how do we know that?

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u/Enticing_Venom 3d ago

Perhaps start by getting to the point where he can admit he did something wrong, instead of making excuses for himself in the press?

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u/LapiceraParker 3d ago

didn't he admitted it?

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u/BranWafr 3d ago

He admitted he did it, he has not really admitted it was wrong. Or, more specifically, admitted that he feels any remorse for having done it.

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u/Tirrm 3d ago

I mean, "I cannot reverse it, so I will have to bear the consequences. It has been the biggest mistake of my life.". It was literally there. Right in the article that we all clicked on to get to these comments. Whether he actually feels remorse and is dedicated to not reoffend is a whole other story but he has expressed it.

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u/Enticing_Venom 3d ago

He also said:

"I have been branded as a sex monster, as a paedophile. That I am not, really not."

Nothing he has said in his statement expresses actual remorse for the harm he caused the victim (who has gone on to self-harm). He just defends himself and downplays his actions as a "mistake" when it was a series of intentional choices made over a 2 year period.

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u/XavinNydek 3d ago

That's not remorse, that's being sorry he was caught.

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u/Tirrm 3d ago

I don't disagree with you. I just felt the person I responded to was being disingenuous by saying he hadn't expressed ANY remorse but of course he edited his post after I made mine.

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u/ferret_80 3d ago

Notice he doesn't say exactly what was the biggest mistake, that he will have to bear.

He thinks getting caught was his mistake, not his grooming or raping.

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u/steve_french07 1h ago

Not a single word about his victim. That’s a huge tell about where his head’s at.

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u/ELpork 3d ago

Clinical/criminal phycologists would probably have an idea when it comes to timeframes. One of the reasons it's a shame mental health and prison have become homogenized in this country.

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u/Cruciblelfg123 3d ago

You can’t whole heartedly change anything about yourself in a year. You can’t truly swear off Oreos in a year. I don’t know where the line is but it is super blatantly obviously a billion miles away from one year

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u/Underdogg13 3d ago

I mean let's be honest with ourselves; none of us can make absolute statements on this. It's all speculation.

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u/NOT_MEEHAN 3d ago

You can’t whole heartedly change anything about yourself in a year.

I stopped drinking 2 years ago. I was the worst alcoholic I've ever seen in my lifetime before I did. People can change if they get help, not sure he wants to.

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u/Cruciblelfg123 3d ago

Purely anecdotal but I wouldn’t trust you not to relapse on drinking within the first year of your sobriety if you drinking again meant the rape of a child personally

But anecdote aside good shit keep it up man

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u/NOT_MEEHAN 3d ago

The first 3 months were the hardest part of it all. It's not even a challenge to stay sober now. Inpatient treatment plus 8 months of sober living was what I needed.

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u/Cruciblelfg123 3d ago

As someone who bought coke instead of fixing their car week after week about a decade ago, all I’m gonna say is don’t get comfortable and think “I did it”. You did it, but you probably arent done dealing with it. At some point maybe you’ll legitimately be in your worst head space and still look at booze and think “that looks like more work than it’s worth im over it”, but personally I got lucky a bunch of time and in retrospect there was moments I could have slipped and blown up my life. Recently got hit with a literal “hey we got 200$ worth of pure coke and have to get on a plane you want it?” and legitimately in my soul thought No No I honestly don’t want it. But in the last decade even though I quit, realistically that would have broke me

Again, I don’t mean any of this negatively or judgementally. I just think holy shit I’m lucky some times and think it’s something that doesn’t get said enough. And again good shit man keep it up

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u/NOT_MEEHAN 3d ago

I mean yeah a relapse is always on the table because I'm still convinced alcohol is the best invention ever. The thing that keeps me sober is my ego. My ego says "you're better than this" so I have to act like it. Sober I'm a better son, brother, uncle, friend, and employee. I just try to always be the best version of myself which makes not getting drunk as much as i love it easier. Good on you for getting it taken care of.

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u/EvilMaran 3d ago

i quit alcohol/cocaine/speed/xtc/molly/smoking all at different times in my life and all were serious addictions, no help just wanting to be better. i can honestly say i am no longer an addict, i don't need it anymore, i dont like it anymore, even though i have some great memories from that period.

It sounds like you are projecting, you havent dealt with it yet, so others can't deal with it either.

I hope you figure it out, but you are just as anecdotal as the other guy and me.

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u/_Dreamer_Deceiver_ 3d ago

Yeh you can. I wasnt alcohol dependant but I did drink a lot and just went "I'll stop that now" and did

Eating less was harder, it took 9 months to bed in but I did. Its been 6 years since I did that and still haven't reverted back to eating like a pig

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u/Marchinelli 3d ago

Not sure how you became the arbiter of rate of change in all humans

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u/LapiceraParker 3d ago

looks like he did, and he must be right, this is reddit after all!

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u/Bloodyjorts 3d ago

Well I can tell you it's more than a year. I don't truly think pedophiles/child rapists can every be truly 'rehabilitated' or be considered not a danger around children, but even if someone did, they could not rationally think it could be done within a year. Especially not if the rapist NEVER took accountability or acknowledged the harm he caused (which this one hasn't).

That's not a pedophile truly ashamed of his actions, that's a pedophile annoyed he got caught.

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u/FeonixRizn 3d ago

For grooming and raping a child? Life.

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u/Stnq 3d ago

It's not even about time, it's about him still being able to act on his urges. Chemical or surgical castration and you can let him out, since he'll have trouble acting on his urges.

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u/whatisthishownow 3d ago

I don’t know, but the fact that he is vocally unrepentant shows that he is not fit to be part of society, let alone an international representative.

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u/Purple_Falcone 3d ago

For raping a child - I’m going to go objective and say at least 25 years in a prison where you yourself are likely to be raped

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u/Electrical-Tap-5633 3d ago

Have him castrated so he can't rape another child?

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u/Itsametoad 2d ago

To me this guy will always be a danger

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u/imminentjogger5 3d ago

1 year is fine with chemical castration

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u/drink_with_me_to_day 3d ago

1 year is not enough time

How much is enough time for sex crimes? That's not the kind of line on the sand that is easily redrawn...

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u/Infini-Bus 3d ago

Well it should depend on the nature of the sex crime. Child rape should be life.

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u/Itsametoad 2d ago

Oof I'd say probably a good 25-30 years, probably more tbh. I want them to come out once they're old and most of their life has passed by.

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u/Senior_Ad680 3d ago

80 to 90 years, torture optional.

It’s easily the worst crime possible.

1 year is your fucking line?

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u/Fragrant-Insurance53 3d ago

Psycho bloodthirsty nonsense. Killing someone is the worst possible crime.

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u/Senior_Ad680 3d ago

No, it isn’t.

You clearly haven’t lived through hell.

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u/sleeptilnoonenergy 3d ago

You're an idiot. What do you think the girl would say if you asked her if she'd rather the crime committed against her be murder rather than statutory rape. I can't believe people this fucking insane exist.

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u/RedS5 3d ago

I'm kind of sort of OK with majorly fucking over 19 year olds who go that out of their way to manipulate and fuck someone they know to be a 12 year old.

I understand your stance here philosophically, but maybe this isn't the time or the place.

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u/Senior_Ad680 3d ago

You, clearly, have had a wonderful life.

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u/Secretfutawaifu 3d ago

No we don't.

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u/Blakath 4d ago

Completely agree, I'm all for the Dutch model of reformation, but 1 year seems too less a time. If it were something like 3 years than we could give him the benefit of the doubt.

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u/MikesRockafellersubs 4d ago

The Dutch are a pretty racist people, I wouldn't trust them.

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u/Hunter_original 3d ago

That's racist

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u/Mein_Bergkamp 3d ago

Rehabilitating implies learning fom what you did, he still claims he's not a paedophile and keeps getting upset that people are calling him that.

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u/Never_Gonna_Let 3d ago

There is no way to recondition a paraphila. A paraphilia after being acted upon is much much more likely to reoffend, which is why there are things like sex offender registries. There is no way to "rehabilitate' a pedophile. They need to be never be in a position to be able to be alone or communicate with vulnerable people.

Even chemical castration or sex hormone reduction, while it decreases libido, does not change the compulsion.

Until we can re-wire the section of the brain associated with paraphilas, probably best to keep pedophiles and the like out of integrated society.

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u/Top-Decision-3528 3d ago

Can't rehab a pedo, IMO

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u/Low-Union6249 2d ago

It’s good thinking, but it’s not like he’s paid his debts in any other way and it’s unclear why he wouldn’t reoffend

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u/Itsametoad 2d ago

I'm sorry but I feel like some criminals can't be rehabilitated, and some don't even deserve the opportunity

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u/Light01 1d ago

That's not the dutch, that's literally everywhere but america.

Prison costs are insane, can't expect to just have people in there forever, costing money for no reason. That's why it's hard to build new prisons, people don't want to work in them, and the costs to maintain them are always going up.

Not giving my opinion on it, but I've never ever read anything saying that prison isn't for rehabilitation outside of America (continent).

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u/Senior_Ad680 3d ago

Fuck that, not for pedos.

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u/SnooStrawberries620 4d ago edited 4d ago

This isn’t learning how not to steal. This is a disease. Castration is the only thing that has proven effective but hey, why would you want to have the perpetrator suffer? Just let the child’s life be ruined and encourage the next generation of sick fucks instead. 

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u/BuffDrBoom 4d ago

This sounds less like a scholarly opinion, and more like you indulging in a revenge fetish

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u/Stravven 4d ago

Only this wasn't the Dutch, but the UK.

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u/Radiant_Doughnut2112 4d ago

This was the dutch. He was literally sent to Dutch to do his sentence and got released by the Dutch 1 year later.

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u/Lorn_Muunk 4d ago

In a dutch prison

Nah, according to his wiki he was extradited, tried in front of a UK court and served 1 out of 4 years of his sentence in a UK prison

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u/Benbejamminboy 4d ago

Tbf he was allowed to return to the Netherlands to complete the rest of his sentence in a dutch prison. He just subsequently got let out of that prison.

The 4 years sentencing was far too little in the first place for what he did + the fact that he shows zero remorse for it... absolute shambles

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u/Lorn_Muunk 4d ago

Right, the "time served" verdict was absurd and I completely agree with your second sentence.

In fact, he tried to play the victim by pretending he was an ignorant and confused teenager himself. That doesn't track with a 19 year old man grooming, drugging and raping a 12 year old repeatedly after waiting out her parents.

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u/Vaenyr 4d ago

The English article is written a bit weird for that section. Articles in other languages, like the German one, specify that he served a year in a Dutch prison, as do some news articles.

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u/WolfetoneRebel 4d ago

Not a great look for the Dutch, their judicial system, penal system, or Olympic committee. Whether or not it’s “the rules” or not, enough people should have been kicking off well before now. Shameful.

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u/Wonderful_Net_9131 4d ago

Germany is equally as bad when it comes to sentences for child rapists. It's so strange. It's the one crime everyone (including other criminals) can agree on is one of the worst, yet they come off that lightly.

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u/artavenue 4d ago

„fun fact“ about germany: sex with a 14 year old is legal. A lot of things are also based on „old“ christian times when couples married with 16 or something.

The singer of rammstein did that, slept with the bff of his own daughter on their vacation. But it was legal so it is not part of any of the news story his cases had.

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u/Wonderful_Net_9131 4d ago

Depends on the circumstances. Only legal of the child is deemed mature enough and No other factors are at play. Still wrong, but hopefully not that big of a deal in practice as you can convict predators by other means.

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u/artavenue 4d ago

Correct, i decided to keep my post short. I snitch in that rammstein bit every time i can, because NO ONE talks about it. But: the circumstances part is not really that huge, of course, rape is illegal, i think one-night-stand intentions also (it has to be a real relationship?) and it can‘t be a teacher or something like that. Correct me if i am wrong, i looked into this years ago

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u/Balthasar-Hohenheim 3d ago

So the German age of consent is basically split into three stages. The base is that sexual contact to anyone below 14 is strictly illegal. The 14 here is not based on any "old christian rules" but is tied to the age of criminal responsibility. The idea is that two 14 year olds shouldn't be arrested for being in a relationship. Many states in the US had to introduce so called "Romeo and Juliet"-laws to deal with this. This age of consent is raised to 16 if the child is either too immature or uneducated. German sexual education seems to be considered to be sufficient education but that doesn't mean that this applies to the sexual education in other countries. While the age of 16 is also the age you can get married here, these rules are actually not directly related. 16 is just the age that people are considered mature enough to legally sign contracts, which is the prerequisite to get married (you still need the approval of the guardian). The actual protection for children is the third rule. Any relationship that involves a minor and that has a power imbalance/ any form of one sided dependency is illegal. This involves most adults that a child would normally have contact to like teachers, friends of family and strangers that give them gifts. Over the age of 18 you are an adult and can have any relationship you want (as long as it doesn't breach other laws). I'm not sure if this system is really the best and talks about lowering the age of criminal responsibility in recent years had me asking what that would mean for the age of consent but so far it works. Maybe we should have taken the opportunity to fully revamp the system when the gay paragraph was removed (as the last iteration raised the age of consent to 18 in same sex relationships).

Regardless I have to agree the no matter how well behaved the guy was in prison, one year for someone who actually raped anyone let alone a 12 year old child is way to little! Back in the late 90s there was a running joke in my class that you would get a longer prison sentence for copying infringements than for child rape and while this has somewhat improved since the sentence are still to low. Thought I guess the worst pedophiles never go to prison but straight to the asylum, so that might warp my perception a bit.

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u/thelastgozarian 3d ago

Not that it matters when it comes to fucking 12 yr olds because that's wrong 1000 perce t of the tjme but no, most places don't have Romeo and juliet "laws" but do operate under that precedent. That said there are certainly cases where someone has gotten fucked by the long hard dick of the law assuming it was totally cool to bone their 1 year younger s.o. Usually it's a way to fuck someone with priors, but plenty of places will say illegal is illegal even a year apart.

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u/Wonderful_Net_9131 4d ago

I seem to remember that relationship bit as well and noticed articles talking about that Lindemann incident speaking of a "relationship", tho I have a hard time believing it was actually that. when you're 21 and kinda immature you might have a true relationship with a mature 16yo... But your daughters best friend?

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u/artavenue 4d ago

She was 14 or 15, yeah. His daughter asked if her best friend can join. Lindemann kept this relationship alive until recently, even. The girl is now like 25+ old woman or something. He was also already super old when she was 15. 21 and 16 can be weird, but probably accepted. In my friend circle when i was a teenager i saw this sometimes happen. We were also friend with the 21 year old and no one was really educated. Big groups of teens hanging in the street. I think, in modern times the grooming online part just makes everything more secret and worse.

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u/mileswilliams 4d ago

The Dutch system focuses on rehabilitation not punishment. I think longer would have been appropriate.

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u/WolfetoneRebel 4d ago

Regardless, there is no way people should accept someone like that representing them on the world stage.

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u/mileswilliams 3d ago

For the sake of a huge laugh, please tell me you are American?

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u/airtime25 3d ago

You got down voted but we literally are going to have a rapist lead our country and we will have chose him twice lol while Americans are shaking in their boots that a criminal will be at the Olympics.

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u/WolfetoneRebel 3d ago

Why does it matter where I’m from?

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u/petit_cochon 4d ago

People go into therapy longer for slapping a classmate at school. Christ.

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u/Taolan13 4d ago

regular violence is worse than sexual violence just look at comparative sentencing.

woman kills her abusive husband or boyfriend in self defense and gets 20 years no parole despite an otherwise clean record.

a repeat offender on their sixth victim under 18 gets two years and probation.

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u/damola93 4d ago edited 4d ago

No one is defending the dude; he sucks and is a despicable human being. The problem people have is using private institutions like the IOC to settle “wrongs” in society. Why in God’s green earth is a dude sentenced to 4 years for raping a minor? Not only does he get a short sentence, he only serves one year of it.

The same journos pressuring the IOC also believe in short prison sentences or don't believe in imprisonment as a response to crime. It is not a sports story; it is a story of lenient policies on crime, allowing disgusting animals like this to re-enter society after just serving 25% of his sentence. Are you telling me you would be okay with it if he were your mailman? If he was not an Olympian, it seems no one would care.

Why isn't the ire being directed at the justice system in the UK or Holland? How would the IOC ban him from fixing that fundamental issue? He has paid his debt to society, given the lenient policies on crime Europe is ok with, unless he happens to be an Olympian.

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u/vin_nm 4d ago

Don’t private institutions settle wrongdoings everyday with their hiring practices? You can refuse to hire a felon for their record, but can’t ban him from participating in the Olympics because why?

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u/Grabbsy2 3d ago

In canada, you cannot refuse to hire people based on the specifics of their criminal record. If he was arrested for shoplifting, but youre hiring him as an exterior lanscaper, youre legally obligated not to hold that against him, whereas if youre running a daycare and the guy is a pedophile, you dont hire him, obviously.

In terms of the olympics, i doubt the athletes have any access to children. Its a theoretical non-issue. (Though it certainly is a PR issue)

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u/Halospite 3d ago

A shitton of famous pedophiles used their fame to get access to children, wtf are you talking about?

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u/EtTuBiggus 4d ago

Because the Olympics isn’t a private institution. We can’t even seem to ban the Russians who cheat. Why would they care about something half the IOC probably does?

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u/AtLeastThisIsntImgur 3d ago

The IOC is a private and heavily corrupt institution that has banned people over lesser shit than doping and rape

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u/EtTuBiggus 2h ago

Their wiki page has a section on their ‘oath’ that makes them look like a cult.

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u/twistedspin 3d ago

There are honors that one doesn't give to horrible people when they've committed atrocities, even when they've "paid their debt to society".

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u/Shawodiwodi13 4d ago

As far as I know is that in The Netherlands it is a different conviction. It is by law having sex with a minor and that doesn’t mean it is rape. So when he was brought over to The Netherlands he had served his time for Dutch law. So he was released. I personally would like the fact that someone who is convicted of a serious crime shouldn’t be representing his country anymore but that is against the law and would prevent certain people to run for president 🤣

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u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

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u/tlollz52 4d ago

Yea this is my beef with so many of the people who want to rip sex offenders for their short sentences. This guy committed a heinous and horrible act. He did the time he was sentenced to. Hopefully he doesn't recommit but we can't really blame him for a lack of punishment.

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u/KriegerClone02 4d ago

That's not what we're blaming him for.

The weak punishments are why the idea that "he paid his debt to society" is spectacularly unconvincing.

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u/tlollz52 4d ago

Hard to quantify how someone can pay their debt to society.

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u/troll_right_above_me 4d ago

Removing him from society would be a surefire way to make sure he doesn't rape another child.

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u/tlollz52 4d ago

I agree. These charges are often too lenient

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u/aheroafaked 4d ago

A good 50 fucking years without parole for raping a 12 year old sounds about right

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u/2canbehumble 4d ago

Or hanging

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u/John3Fingers 4d ago

Some can't. Chomos should be turned into mulch.

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u/tlollz52 4d ago

So you believe in the death penalty?

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u/John3Fingers 3d ago

I don't have a moral problem with it, if that's what you mean. I'm not a theist, I don't think all human life is inherently valuable.

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u/tlollz52 3d ago

I don't believe in the death penalty, not because I view all human life as equal but because I don't believe our justice system to be infallible. I don't trust our justice system to do every investigation to the letter of the law and I believe many plead guilty without actually having never committed a crime. I also believe police can be biased and get tunnel vision when they feel they have the right guy.

This isn't me saying these crimes are charged fairly and most get a proper punishment, but I don't have enough confidence in our justice system for them to pass on judgment in ways of execution, especially for those who have only been convicted of a singular offense.

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u/Fuzakenaideyo 4d ago

We may not be able to blame him for his lack of punishment but we can blame him for what he did!

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u/tlollz52 4d ago

Sure, and that has already happened. He's been blamed, charged, and completed his sentence.

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u/osku1204 4d ago

he might have paid his debt To the dutch legal system but People are in no way obliged To forgive him especially for crime so henious.

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u/Vaenyr 4d ago

He only completed a quarter of his sentence.

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u/tlollz52 3d ago

Sounds about right, unfortunately.

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u/Flushles 4d ago

He went to counseling after according to another article I read and they found him unlikely to re-offend that coupled with the fact it was 10 years ago seems like he probably won't, this is why I'm not sure people believe in forgiveness they only want leniency for things they don't think are a big deal anyway it seems.

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u/Definition_Friendly 4d ago

Your right, for something like this I don't believe in forgiveness at all and I believe he should still be in prison with at least a few more times the length of time he'd have served ahead of him.

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u/Suitable-Juice-9738 3d ago

So if he never offends again, you still think this is mind-numbing?

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u/MikesRockafellersubs 4d ago

Also, even if he did a much longer sentence, no one has to like you when you get out, they just can't keep you locked up anymore.

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u/_trouble_every_day_ 3d ago

So you're ok with setting the precedent that criminals can't participate in the olympics? Because that's actual the issue, not whether or not it's a great thing that a specific individual gets to play.

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u/reflectionnorthern 3d ago

Fuck that. He's forever bad. Should NOT be allowed on the team. It's incredibly disrespectful to the victim

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u/CrossP 3d ago

A chance to get a job and live a life with the basic rights of a free citizen? Sure. That's what the legal system says even if it was a stupidly short sentence.

But representing a country even in something as trivial as the olympics? That's stupid. That's not a "right".

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u/teh_fizz 3d ago

Yeah. It’s disgusting how many people in the Dutch subs are ok with him playing.

Fine you think one year is enough, that’s on you, but why are you ok with him representing the country in the Olympics.

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u/Top-Decision-3528 3d ago

Meanwhile that girl is going to have tons of issues and psychological damage

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u/Itsametoad 2d ago

Damn guess I should pull up to the Netherlands and commit crimes if they're that cool with that

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u/starfire92 4d ago

As someone who was groomed and molested/SAd by my male cousin between 10-11 and he was 16 I never told anyone in my family because I was scared it would be overlooked like this. I was scared people would say I wanted it because I didn’t object because in reality I didn’t object. I willingly followed him into the bathrooms when he would take me and willingly went with him but had ZERO understanding of what was going on. He once put his hands inside me and all I kept saying was ow this hurts and I didn’t know what it was. I remember when I saw him fully aroused for the first time I yelled, I was scared. I didn’t know the male body worked that way and yet I somehow thought I was wrong for hurting his feelings. I felt some type of need to not make him upset. That I’d be wrong for rejecting these advances. I didn’t know I was allowed to say no and I didn’t how this was inappropriate but I knew it had to be a secret.

As soon as I got older and understood the severity of what happened I was ashamed all my life, it’s a trauma that has held me back mentally and in intimate spaces with consensual partners. My feelings went from acceptance as a child, shame in my teens, fear as a young adult and now anger. I thought I could hide it and pretend it never happened and I thought it was my fault.

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u/Immediate_Revenue_90 2d ago

Similar situation with me, I was 15 and definitely knew what sex was but didn’t know what was happening because it was during episodes of psychosis 

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u/2canbehumble 3d ago

Very sorry to hear of your everlasting ordeal. It’s the victims that should feel exonerated not the perpetrators. They should be surgically prevented from re offending. It’s the only solution

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u/starfire92 3d ago

Haha I wish I could have that guy surgically altered for what he did. His sister also did it to me once too to me and it made me wonder what happened to them for them both to be predators like that

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u/SonOfMetrum 4d ago

I’m Dutch and I don’t. Fuck this guy…

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u/mamapizzahut 4d ago

I would really like to hear someone Dutch explain this. In the US rape of a minor is one of the most serious imaginable offenses. Clearly there is a different approach there - how do they justify it?

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u/labrat420 4d ago

In the US rape of a minor is one of the most serious imaginable offenses

Depends on how much money you have. The Dupont heir got zero jail time for raping his 3 year old daughter

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u/ash_274 3d ago

(Roman Polanski has entered the chat via French IP address)

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u/Plintsje058 4d ago

Im from the netherlands and i realy cant explain it, the sentence for child abuse is very low if your under 18 (if im remeber the story right he was) even if youre above 18 its kinda low. Ive never seen this story in the media to be honest and im shocked to read this.

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u/mirage2101 4d ago

I don’t think the judgement is public yet, I can’t find it so we don’t know what the judge was thinking.

Some background.. Van der Velde was 19 at the time this happened. He was absolutely shocked and cried when he heard what trauma he caused the girl. In hindsight he admits he shouldn’t have done it, he explains why he went wrong, but doesn’t try to make things less than they are. He was wrong and that’s it. The police judge the chances of repeating extremely low. For the last seven years he has reintegrated as an exemplary member of society.

Personally, I tend to think the penalty was on the light side. Even if the sex was consensual at the time. (It’s still rape because the girl is considered too young to be able to give informed consent). But that said.. we have laws about what people can and can’t do. And what punishment is appropriate. We appoint judges to apply those rules. It’s not up to the public or media to decide to punish someone a bit more because we don’t like the original penalty.

Without having all the information I have to trust our justice system and assume it did a good job.

And apparently he has been behaving exemplary since he got free, so the system worked?

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u/teh_fizz 3d ago

Van der Velde can shut the fuck yo with his crocodile tears. Absolute BS he was shocked and it’s just performative.

He groomed with girl for two years. Since she was 10.

Then he flew to the UK when her parents were away.

And he got her drunk.

AND raped her three times.

Sorry but fuck his tears. This isn’t some guy who just bumped into a fan and had sex with them. This was malicious intent for two fucking years.

Now he’s upset and crying and wants people to listen to his side of the story. What side? He’s a degenerate that raped a 12 year old in another country that he flew to.

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u/Anthaenopraxia 3d ago

I really think it's important to distinguish between statutory rape and violent rape. I've worked with victims of both and the difference is massive.

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u/dasersteleus 3d ago

(It’s still rape because the girl is considered too young to be able to give informed consent).

This is exactly where the confusion begins. In England it still is considered rape because of the age of the girl. Dutch law disagrees and calls it fornication, which is still a crime, but a much less severe one. Therefore he was released earlier than the English punishment.

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u/The_Enolaer 4d ago

Obviously it's a serious crime in the Netherlands too, but do realize he was only convicted to 4 years in the UK so the "low sentencing", if you will, starts there. Without knowing all the facts about this case, and really none of us do other than the judge and the ones directly involved, I believe there were a few reasons combined: - Admitted immediately what he did - The girl "consented" and admitted she wanted this (I know...) - Experts claimed a very low risk of a repeat offense

Now, don't shoot the messenger. It still doesn't sit well with me and 1 year is bizarre to me, but 4 years seems fair in this case. Why the UK agreed to these terms, you have to ask them.

That being said, I'm a strong proponent of second chances. But to me, a second chance does not necessarily mean you can continue your life like nothing happened. And it certainly does not mean representing our country at the Olympics. It is absolutely disgusting that they value winning over morale. I've contacted the Dutch Olympic organization and the volleyball association to let them know how disgusted I am, but they won't care. They released their statements already and will just deal with any fallout.

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u/ACoconutInLondon 3d ago edited 3d ago

but 4 years seems fair in this case

When researching whether this was a fair number, I found that the average sentence for just rape around this time was 10 years with 2/3 off those convicted being sentences to 7 or more years.

https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2021-09-14/debates/3EBA342C-1391-4B01-BD85-181A604FDFB6/SentencesForRape

If that's the case, how is 4 years for child rape fair?

Also, the judge is quoted as saying that he didn't groom the victim, which would have been used as an argument for a lighter sentence. But also is crazy.

Judge Sheridan said it was not a case of sexual grooming

https://www.miltonkeynes.co.uk/news/would-be-olympian-jailed-after-flying-400-miles-to-rape-a-12-year-old-girl-in-milton-keyn

Edit to add links

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u/ComradeBirdbrain 3d ago

I believe it was less because the judge, and his own lawyer, believed his career was shot into oblivion. Clearly the Dutch had other plans and he’s back in the limelight internationally rather than nationally.

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u/teh_fizz 3d ago

I fucking hate sports celebrities. Fuck his career. The 12 year old girl’s life is fucked now but this guy’s “career” is hurt so only give him 4 years.

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u/The_Enolaer 3d ago

Your link says that 3000 received a sentence of 6 years or less, I don't know the timeframe for that, but a couple of years at most I guess. So saying 4 years cannot be fair seems odd. It's not really even a source, but the words of a politician, but we'll assume these stats are correct.

Also, you trying to prove the judge is wrong based on an article in the media points out how easy some people think criminal cases are judging from the outside. We have absolutely none of the details that matter. Or do you happen to have their chat logs available?

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u/ACoconutInLondon 3d ago

Your link says that 3000 received a sentence of 6 years or less, I don't know the timeframe for that, but a couple of years at most I guess.

11 years give or take. The comment is from 2021 and the Tories came to power in 2010.

So saying 4 years cannot be fair seems odd.

How is that odd when everyone there seems to agree that less than 6 is lenient?

The Tory minister is claiming that 10 years is the average, with 2/3 sentenced to 7 or more - the implication then is that under 6 are outlier.

And that is adult rape based as far as I can tell. Child rape has a slightly higher starting point even for sentencing.

We have absolutely none of the details that matter.

It is a quote from the judge. We have enough of the details that it is difficult to see how the argument could be made that he did not groom her.

And the fact that the judge removed that as a fact of the case is directly related to the sentencing as it would be a factor.

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u/TheGeekOffTheStreet 3d ago

4 years seems fair? For grooming a 10-year-old then raping her 2 years later? That’s vomit inducing. Child rape should be 20-life.

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u/The_Enolaer 3d ago

Luckily people aren't usually sentenced based on public sentiment, but rather on unbiased expertise. And again, you and I don't know any details about the reason for this sentence.

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u/MDA1912 3d ago

Now, don't shoot the messenger. It still doesn't sit well with me and 1 year is bizarre to me,

Fair enough.

but 4 years seems fair in this case.

My condolences to the messenger's family for their loss. Though they deserve it for raising the messenger to make such an egregiously disgusting statement.

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u/The_Enolaer 3d ago

I don't really care if my attempt at being rational doesn't sit well with your knee-jerk "castrate and lock em up for life" sentiment. I'd like to know what you think an appropriate sentence would be, and it would be great if you could tell us why.

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u/God_Damnit_Nappa 3d ago

No you're not trying to be rational, you're being a contrarian for the sake of being a contrarian. And doing it to defend a convicted child rapist is a really bad look

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u/The_Enolaer 3d ago

Funny how you seem to think you know me, you couldn't be more wrong, but if it makes your day, go for it. Of course, the problem is not me, the problem is your inability to understand what I'm saying and that I'm not defending this guy. If that's a bad look in your eyes, I really couldn't care less because your opinion has zero value to me. Plus, you're the one who got downvoted.

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u/disdainfulsideeye 3d ago

By "girl" you mean 12 yr old child.

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u/The_Enolaer 3d ago

It's not a girl?

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u/Mr06506 3d ago

Standard preface here of not defending him....

But, he was 17 when they began chatting. That doesn't make it right, but it makes it less obviously evil than if he was 47 for example.

So I imagine he was tried along the lines of two underage lovers, rather than a predatory older man forcibly raping a random kid.

Also I imagine in terms of risk of reoffending, one consideration would have been that he is just older now, and even if he had another relationship with the same age difference, the girl would not be underage now.

But yeah, 1 year does not seem near enough to combine the multiple goals of rehabilitation, public safety, and an element of punishment.

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u/GalaxyOHare 4d ago

even here it doesnt get near the kind of sentence that it should. they got those mother fuckers in a revolving door. eventually, after being caught and released enough times, the lesson they usually learn is to kill their victim so they cant report them.

it should be life after the first offense. its not about punishment even, its just not fair to the rest of us that they allow these people to roam free, knowing what the recidivism rate is. its bad for society, its not fair to kids.

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u/Strength-InThe-Loins 3d ago

A lot of Dutch people are equally curious about how we Americans justify locking people up for decades in clearly inhumane conditions.

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u/Kilen13 3d ago

Most of Europe has a very different vision of what the purpose of the judicial system and prison is for. Having lived extensively in both Europe and the US my anecdotal experience is that Americans view prison as "punishment" where prisoners should often physically, psychologically and emotionally suffer for their crime. Europeans tend to have a softer approach of viewing prison as a way to rehabilitate people and bring them back into society. This is why many countries have laws that if a prison sentence is short enough (usually under 5 years) the defendant usually won't actually go to prison but instead be on a form of probation. They also seem to have much quicker turnarounds with parole and prisoner release because once they feel there is a low chance of recidivism they feel comfortable releasing felons back into society.

I gotta be honest I much prefer the European approach in like 99% of instances, it feels more rooted in logic and humanitarianism than emotion.

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u/MischiefTulip 3d ago

He was convicted in the UK. So not sure about their sentencing guidelines. He was allowed to do his sentence in Dutch prison. But to me the ones in NL are shockingly low as well. For full on rape of a minor it's 15 to 48 months. But it does stack per victim and can be longer based on other factors. (Force/age of the victim etc) So we do have cases where the perp ended up doing 19 years. (Robert M, got tracked when a pic was found in an US case btw) 

Why he got out after a year I don't know. I do know with good behaviour you can get out after x% of your sentence. Those decisions are made by a judge. There's some commotion here as well and the volleyball and Olympics committees are being bombarded with complaints. So far nothing has happenend. Hopefully international attention will help. 

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u/cansofbeans 4d ago

People should really blow up the social media of the olympics team, Netherlands accounts etc. this needs to be sorted 

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u/SnooStrawberries620 4d ago

I’ve already written the IOC, the Dutch national team in their emails and blown both up in FB. They can’t get enough of an earful from the rest of the world. They have right in their landing page that they support the ban on war criminals yet they celebrate a child rapist. Just as tone deaf and backwards as you can get.

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u/ZuFFuLuZ 3d ago

Big organisations like that are full of bureaucrats and stupid rules. They are probably well aware of how this looks and would love to expell him, but can't really find a way to do it smoothly. You can tell by their statements that they are all trying to shift blame and responsibility to some other organisation.
The team accepted him back, because he has served his time, so they don't have a reason not to take him. The committee accepted him, because he meets all requirements and now they say it's the federation's job to decide what to do. Etc.
This will go on and on until the public backlash becomes so huge that somebody really high up in the IOC has to make a decision.

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u/SnooStrawberries620 3d ago

I mean Mizuno could not sponsor that, for starters

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u/notthisonefornow 4d ago

Most people literally never heard of him, all people i spoke about him said who?

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u/Al_Jazzera 3d ago

Gee, whiz. I don't know if we should let this cat compete, he totally raped a 12 year old he was grooming since the age of 10. I dunno Bob, should we reeealy let this guy be an Olympian? The age of 12 is a little young, and rape just doesn't have a nice ring to it?

Nah, shut up Andy. He just wanted to fuck a middle schooler. Nobody cares. He qualified fair and square. Whats a bit of child rape have to do with it?

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u/Awkward_Attitude_886 3d ago

Kinda funny, this thread is… imagine that justice and vengeance are two difference phenomenon. Then this thread makes more sense. Some folk want revenge, others want the parties involved to heal. American left is pretty blood thirsty, no?